Feedback: Update to version 2.177

Arci

Community Manager
Grepolis Team
We are looking forward to your feedback about version 2.177.
 

Geisti

Cerberus
It is now possible to see the online status of the players in your alliance!
  • This right is automatically granted to alliance Leaders and Founders.
  • A setting on the alliance properties can enable/disable the right for every other member.
Who gives you the right to make Arci, the players and your online time transparent here? Each player should decide for himself, what he gives here by himself price. For my part, I consider this innovation to be a massive intervention in my privacy here. Even if this innovation can be switched off, I have something against it here that anyone, whether founders or leaders can see when I sign up to me. Therefore I am looking for legal assistance in consumer protection. It simply can not be that the privacy of the players will be undermined. There is no concern to any Founder, or a leader, when and how long I have been online in the game.

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Geisti
 

DeletedUser4186

Guest
to say it clear:

no one in GPC like that, but once again inno ignore us

we asked if they don´t see the potential of abusing and the answer was NO

i think sometimes inno reads ah gpc don´t like that so lets make it and vice versa
 

kitiara 24

Divine Envoy
Not serious, right?
If this change stays, the game will be over for me.
Employees may not divulge private data from me, but founders and leaders can do.
If Inno does not finish this farce, then I'm the first to leave this game!
 
This is so bad, NO Inno has no right to put up this change. Real game issues they ignore and just do as they please because players, GPC-members mean nothing to Inno.
Again they forget who is paying their income, who are the reason they have a job (not that they do a good one).
 

Kal Gordon

Pegasus
I find this rather intriguing. At a first glance, it sounds like a useful tool for leaders. Then you think about it a bit and realise how bad this could be.

I am interested in Inno's reasons for doing this: it feels like an invasion of players' privacy. This is in contrast with Inno's general trend of supposed caution about privacy:
  • Account transfer has now been banned, on account of player privacy. (A change which they quietly made without telling the community, probably because they knew that it would be an unpopular one.)
  • The moderation system is completely opaque, supposedly on account of player privacy. (Players are not allowed to know the progress of their report against a player. While the result is generally obvious a short while after it has been imposed, in situations with no ban, it's not clear whether the player was innocent, or whether the report was just ignored / dropped.)
When Inno introduces new parts to the game that reduce player privacy, not only is it concerning as an individual item, but it raises concerns about the legitimacy of their "we value privacy" reasoning for certain other negative changes or aspects of the game.
 

DeletedUser4186

Guest
@Inno i want an i love button for comments to show that i more then like an comment

@Bullspirit Dancer your comment will than be the first comment that gets that i love it from me^^

and @Kal Gordon take a look at ic forum please and read innos reaction to the questions form meli and me to that point
 

morg

Manticore
Players should be able to decide whether they want to share their online status or not. This can be a helpful tool for leaders but unnecessary to invade privacy for that little advantage if there is no consent.

It shouldn't be hidden from regular players who can see their online status.


Right now only founders and leaders can edit and see who has this right, when they edit this right they do that without the other alliance members' knowledge.
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Both Bullspirit Dancer and I got the rights to see online activity, but there is no record about the changed online status rights in the alliance events tab. You can see on the member list we are regular players without any rights except for online status, but can't see who else has similar rights:

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What if Bullspirit Dancer is my opponent on other world, from now on I can track her online status with ~10 min accuracy without her knowledge?
 

Arci

Community Manager
Grepolis Team
What if Bullspirit Dancer is my opponent on other world, from now on I can track her online status with ~10 min accuracy without her knowledge?
Well, this may also apply for forum posts or any other activity in the alliance. If you want to avoid such situation maybe joining your opponent's alliance in a different server is not the smartest choice :)

Thanks for the feedbacks.
 
No its not the same. After 15 - 20 min. you can see that an other player is not active ingame anymore by the color in the memberlist.

That is a big difference. Leaving your desktop on, grepolis as active screen, still the color change after 15.20 min. in dark green.


So I still wait for a serious answer.
 

kitiara 24

Divine Envoy
i think it should be my decision who I reveal when when I am online.
For example, I like to have a look between two meetings in the game, but then I will not really be able to stay long and send off and deff, so I risk an appeal from the AL for my lack of reaction.
That means for me in the last consequence that I can not log in from now on in such a situation, or should we interpret that otherwise?

For me, this is by far the worst innovation for a long time and I will draw my conclusions if that will not be reversed.
 

morg

Manticore
Well, this may also apply for forum posts or any other activity in the alliance. If you want to avoid such situation maybe joining your opponent's alliance in a different server is not the smartest choice :)

Thanks for the feedbacks.

Forum account setting has a Privacy menu that's what I'm missing.
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Many players are here for years and it is inevitable that we become friends with former opponents or some team mates turn against us... it's the circle of the game you can't defy it.
 

Arci

Community Manager
Grepolis Team
By forum I meant alliance forum, but also external platforms may be included such as Discord, Telegram, Whatsapp or any other platform you may use :)

Anyway, the case where your enemy on a server is also the founder/leader of your alliance in another server isn't that common, and again that's your own choice to do so.
 

Geisti

Cerberus
Just give somebody the chance to decide for themselves, whether they are transparent to their founder or leader.

After all, this is about the privacy of the players!

regards
Geisti
 
What is the idea behind this new funktion?

Only to let you know, a long time ago, somebody at DE has created an idea for this, but aprox. 88% won't like it.

Could you ask the responsible people, if it is possible to switch it off on some local markets?
 
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Mimarifap

Hydra
I think this change presents us with a useful new feature. The possibilities of exploitation are actually quite slim. Generally, only in-game abuse can be based on online time knowledge, so no damage is done to one's privacy outside the game itself. And even in the realm of unfair in-game competition, after joining your opponent's alliance, there are other ways for your opponent to estimate when you are online. The change in precision to a more exact system than, let's say, guessing based on a specific kind of in-game activity, is of actual importance only when it comes to cooperation (albeit it's still not a radical improvement). All in all, for me this is a positive change and it should be preserved.
 

morg

Manticore
@Arci it was just an example which happens quite often.
All those listed chat clients allow you to be invisible, maybe it is a better approach to ask how privacy and transparency helps?

I have no doubts this function can be useful when a team was together for a longer time and trust each other, just like how we give forum moderator, reservation rights to every alliance member in premade teams or after a few weeks to newer members who seem to stick with us, but I would personally disable my online status visibility on new worlds / unknown team...

Generally, only in-game abuse can be based on online time knowledge, so no damage is done to one's privacy outside the game itself.
How many players switch alliance on same server, join opponents etc. - intel is crucial part of the game, you don't want to make your online status public for anyone nor let founders do that over your head.

If players could give consent to share their online status it would authorize founders and leaders to share these rights with more players for example with those who also gave consent and make the best out of this new feature without worries that anyone would blame them or Innogames for their invaded privacy, even if it's just ingame privacy which I believe you would disagree with if you got overnight pings after this feature debuted however you never had such attacks before...

As someone with founder experience I would not give this right to all alliance members as it is now... that again questions how useful it is if others think alike.

What is the idea behind this new funktion?
That's a very good question. We don't really know yet how reliable it can be... but we all know statistics show only minimum 1 hour or longer inactivity so this feature can potentially help alliances to be one step ahead within that 60 min time frame.

Lost trip
~15min ago enemy killed your trip / sentinel, you check member list and see...
... the player was online ~10 minutes ago = you don't have to worry, don't have to send harbor check, can spare the message, don't have to ask others what happened... just replace trip.
... the player was online ~50 minutes ago = you have to take necessary steps to prevent losses.

Less friendly pings
Pings from alliance members can be just as annoying as enemy attacks.
if you see online players who can help then you won't bother alerting the rest of the team for no good reason just to get someone online

Imagine how cool it would be if all members with consent could use this feature when a trip was killed and would not have to rely on founders / leaders, pings anymore...

It should have never been a founder / leader decision who can see the online status and a privilege to know which players got this right.
Players should be able to set online status visible for all members / for leaders / no one.
 

DeletedUser4186

Guest
Well, this may also apply for forum posts or any other activity in the alliance. If you want to avoid such situation maybe joining your opponent's alliance in a different server is not the smartest choice :)

Thanks for the feedbacks.

lol did you really understand what you are write here???? Its usual for Players who play more worlds, that other players are Friends on world x, pact on world y but are enemis at world Z, so you dont joing the ally from you opponent youo join YOUR Ally with an member that can abuse that infos on other worlds

By forum I meant alliance forum, but also external platforms may be included such as Discord, Telegram, Whatsapp or any other platform you may use :)

Anyway, the case where your enemy on a server is also the founder/leader of your alliance in another server isn't that common, and again that's your own choice to do so.

lol again. sorry Arci i will surely not punish you or troll you or something like that, buat did you really know what you read or know what this change can do?
it seems that this is not the case. there don´t must be a leader here and there a enemy. because you can give that right to see ALL Players of your ally and not singlewise just all member or no member.
gAVboqL8UCAKssvx-Bereich.png


so EVERY Member could seen this

and i am alwas a leader on worlds i play but i don´t want a feature that can be abused by players and gives important datas to other players

Forum account setting has a Privacy menu that's what I'm missing.
View attachment 554

Many players are here for years and it is inevitable that we become friends with former opponents or some team mates turn against us... it's the circle of the game you can't defy it.

Amen

I think this change presents us with a useful new feature. The possibilities of exploitation are actually quite slim. Generally, only in-game abuse can be based on online time knowledge, so no damage is done to one's privacy outside the game itself. And even in the realm of unfair in-game competition, after joining your opponent's alliance, there are other ways for your opponent to estimate when you are online. The change in precision to a more exact system than, let's say, guessing based on a specific kind of in-game activity, is of actual importance only when it comes to cooperation (albeit it's still not a radical improvement). All in all, for me this is a positive change and it should be preserved.

ironic????
 

Arci

Community Manager
Grepolis Team
@AnWePe it's your choice to stay on an alliance where your opponent (of another server) has your info. If you don't like to give such info, join another alliance.
 
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